Welcome to Cleveland! How many theatres here offer one to a couple hundred dollars, or even 400 dollars for 6-8 weeks for the run of a show?<div><br></div><div>You can't make a living in the arts here in Cleveland. Sad, but true. Honestly, it is no one else's business other than that particular artist who makes that choice to donate their services to a cause that they personally feel is important enough to spend their time and their money on.</div>
<div><br></div><div>Yes, as a professional I would like to always be paid how much I feel I am worth. But let's face it ... it's Northeastern, Ohio. I am not AEA, SAG or AGMA ... or IATSE ... But then again, with all of those contracts together, what is the ratio of how much union work there is put together in this region compared to how many union actors/artists/etc we have locally?</div>
<div><br></div><div>I do believe that everyone should be paid what they are worth; but realistically... in any business, is anyone? Whatever happened to a professional wanting to be generous and do something because they love it?</div>
<br><div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Mar 9, 2011 at 10:30 AM, Evie Morris <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:bachtobroadway42@sbcglobal.net">bachtobroadway42@sbcglobal.net</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
<div><div style="font-family:times new roman,new york,times,serif;font-size:12pt">Folks,<br> I do not usually get angry enough to publicly express my feelings.<br> However, reading that post last night after playing a 3 hour rehearsal pushed my tired, hurting fingers to respond.<br>
I was being sarcastic, about using CD's and downloading music. Sorry to confuse the issue.<br> My initial reaction was to asking anyone who seriously composes music to donate their time and labor for someone else's project for nothing.<br>
I felt that was rude and demeaning to the artists and colleagues I know who are serious composers and musicians. <br> Very often when people are asked to do something for free, there is an offer of credit, a copy of the finished project for resume and experience-building, or some kind of
payment should the film fly.<br> No compensation of any kind was included in the post. Evie<br><br><div><br></div><div style="font-family:times new roman,new york,times,serif;font-size:12pt"><br><div style="font-family:times new roman,new york,times,serif;font-size:12pt">
<font face="Tahoma" size="2"><hr size="1"><b><span style="font-weight:bold">From:</span></b> Robert Hawkes <<a href="mailto:rhhawkes@gmail.com" target="_blank">rhhawkes@gmail.com</a>><br><b><span style="font-weight:bold">To:</span></b> David Seth <<a href="mailto:magicdsm@gmail.com" target="_blank">magicdsm@gmail.com</a>><br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Cc:</span></b> <a href="mailto:neohiopal@neohiopal.org" target="_blank">neohiopal@neohiopal.org</a><br><b><span style="font-weight:bold">Sent:</span></b> Wed, March 9, 2011 10:08:12 AM<br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Subject:</span></b> Re: [NEohioPAL] scoring person needed - Hunh?<br></font><div><div></div><div class="h5"><br>
Why is so much of this conversation about copyright? The original post [<b>need person to score a movie by april 6th. unpaid. 3 main themes and 2
variations combining 2 themes. i am just the messenger so send me your
info and i will pass it on to the director. thank you!</b>] says nothing about stealing anybody else's stuff. <br><br>I repeat: <br><br>Two issues here:<br><br>1. The job description is over-optimistic,
unrealistic,and apparently heedless of the compositional difficulties involved. It is
indeed a huge job to ask somebody to do for no pay. Presumably the
producer has no choice in the matter. <br>
<br>2. Working for no pay: One might do it as a labor of love, if one
were intimately associated with the project. One might do it because the
work represents some sort of opportunity for exposure,"foot in the
door", etc. And etc. It is not an entirely outrageous idea. And certainly not
worth any tax on my blood pressure. <br>
<br>best to all<br><br>Hawkes<br><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Mar 9, 2011 at 9:58 AM, David Seth <span dir="ltr"><<a rel="nofollow" href="mailto:magicdsm@gmail.com" target="_blank">magicdsm@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);padding-left:1ex">
<div style="word-wrap:break-word">To add to Richard's underlying post (at the bottom of this email), when he and I used "The Doll Song" from Offenbach's "Tales of Hoffmann" last year, I first made sure that it was out of copyright and then input the score and generated sound files so that no recording copyrights would be violated. <div>
<br></div><div>I also recently responded to a NEOhioPAL post requesting a copy of music from Les Miz with URLs of where to buy or lease the music. </div><div><br></div><div>What I see from the post that prompted this thread is a dichotomy between one's proprietary interest in one's own work, and a complete neglect of sharing that respect for the work of others. Piracy on the high seas is still frowned upon, but piracy in the music world is business-as-usual. </div>
<div><br></div><div>Freedom of information does not mean freedom to profit from something belonging to someone else. There's a fascinating/frustrating article in a recent issue of The Dramatist by Jason Robert Brown addressing this very issue.</div>
<div><br></div><div>Cheers,</div><div>Deb Magid<br><div><br><div><div>On Mar 9, 2011, at 9:35 AM, Robert Hawkes wrote:</div><br><blockquote type="cite">Two issues here:<br><br>1. The job description is over-optimistic, unrealistic,and apparently heedless of the difficulties involved. It is indeed a huge job to ask somebody to do for no pay. Presumably the producer has no choice in the matter. <br>
<br>2. Working for no pay: One might do it as a labor of love, if one were intimately associated with the project. One might do it because the work represents some sort of opportunity for exposure,"foot in the door", etc. It is not an entirely outrageous idea. And certainly not worth any tax on my blood pressure. <br>
<br>best to all<br><br>Hawkes<br><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Mar 9, 2011 at 9:08 AM, Barbara Barrett <span dir="ltr"><<a rel="nofollow" href="mailto:barbara.iyalode@gmail.com" target="_blank">barbara.iyalode@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);padding-left:1ex">Wow. I absolutely NEVER jump into these conversations, but this one... Is this for real, seriously? I'm not sure that I'd have even been cool with being the messenger on this one. I understand people needing help on projects. I've given generous assistance, and been given generous assistance over the years, and I'm sure that will continue. I've had to do without personally, or postpone stuff so that I could pay up. I've also bartered. Sometimes it was WELL worth it, sometimes not so much so. But my goodness, I sing and write songs, charts, etc, and my parents paid good money for me to get a degree in music. Besides my time, effort, and creative/emotional output. I agree with Evie. What makes people think it's OK to just ask folks to do MAJOR WORK on short (RIDICULOUSLY SHORT) notice, for free, right off the top of the
conversation? There must be a missing piece here... Surely the person who sent the messenger out, must not have given the messenger complete information to relay... or else this is SPAM. <br>
<br><div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Mar 9, 2011 at 12:18 AM, Richard B. Ingraham <span dir="ltr"><<a rel="nofollow" href="mailto:rbingraham@sbcglobal.net" target="_blank">rbingraham@sbcglobal.net</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);padding-left:1ex">
<div lang="EN-US"><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;color:rgb(31, 73, 125)">Just a note here:</span></p><div><span style="font-size:11pt;color:rgb(31, 73, 125)"> </span><br>
</div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;color:rgb(31, 73, 125)">Just because the composer is deceased doesn’t mean that use of a particular recording by that composer is not protected by copyright. The rights to the recording are completely separate from the rights to the composition. So while it’s perfectly legal for me to record my own version of a Bach composition and use it in a show, film, etc., without paying any royalties, it is not legal for me to take a recording of the Cleveland Orchestra performing that same composition and use it without their permission, which typically of course would not be free to obtain.</span></p>
<div><span style="font-size:11pt;color:rgb(31, 73, 125)"> </span><br></div><div><span style="font-size:11pt;color:rgb(31, 73, 125)"> </span><br></div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;color:rgb(31, 73, 125)">Richard B. Ingraham</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;color:rgb(31, 73, 125)">RBI Computers and Audio</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;color:rgb(31, 73, 125)"><a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.rbicompaudio.20m.com/" target="_blank"><span style="color:blue">www.rbicompaudio.20m.com</span></a></span></p>
<div><span style="font-size:11pt;color:rgb(31, 73, 125)"> </span><br></div><div><span style="font-size:11pt;color:rgb(31, 73, 125)"> </span><br></div><div><span style="font-size:11pt;color:rgb(31, 73, 125)"> </span><br>
</div>
<div style="border-width:medium medium medium 1.5pt;border-style:none none none solid;border-color:blue;padding:0in 0in 0in 4pt"><div><div style="border-width:1pt medium medium;border-style:solid none none;border-color:rgb(181, 196, 223);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10pt">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10pt"> <a rel="nofollow" href="mailto:neohiopal-bounces@lists.neohiopal.org" target="_blank">neohiopal-bounces@lists.neohiopal.org</a> [mailto:<a rel="nofollow" href="mailto:neohiopal-bounces@lists.neohiopal.org" target="_blank">neohiopal-bounces@lists.neohiopal.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Evie Morris<br>
<b>Sent:</b> March 08, 2011 11:29 PM<br><b>To:</b> <a rel="nofollow" href="mailto:makers74@gmail.com" target="_blank">makers74@gmail.com</a><br><b>Cc:</b> <a rel="nofollow" href="mailto:neohiopal@neohiopal.org" target="_blank">neohiopal@neohiopal.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [NEohioPAL] scoring person needed</span></p></div></div><div><div></div><div><div> <br></div><div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12pt">Scoring person? Of course you meant to say composer or at the very least, musician.<br>
Score a movie in less than a month? Sure, that requires no skill at all. I know a guy who drives the University Circle bus.<br>He can probably do it for you on his lunch break.<br>Unpaid? This same issue has come up for actors in our theater community.Why would anyone who has spent time and money, usually for many years, to receive training to do something like " SCORE A MOVIE " expect any kind of compensation for the time and effort they put in to sync a movie with music that connects emotionally and artistically to what is up on the screen?<br>
Maybe you can download some Miley Cyrus or Justin Bieber. Oops, wrong, you'd have to pay the artists for their work.<br> You could visit your local library They've got loads of CD's by dead composers and one-hit wonders.<br>
If one doesn't have the respect and perspective to offer compensation, even if it be post- production with barter, in kind, or real dollars, why would anyone who has the ability, experience, and talent to score your movie do it for nothing?<br>
<br> Evie Morris<br> <br> <br> <br><br> </p></div><div><div> <br></div><div><div class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:center" align="center">
<span style="font-size:10pt"><hr align="center" width="100%" size="1"></span></div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12pt"><b><span style="font-size:10pt">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10pt"> mike akers <<a rel="nofollow" href="mailto:makers74@gmail.com" target="_blank">makers74@gmail.com</a>><br>
<b>To:</b> <a rel="nofollow" href="mailto:neohiopal@neohiopal.org" target="_blank">neohiopal@neohiopal.org</a><br><b>Sent:</b> Tue, March 8, 2011 6:31:27 PM<br><b>Subject:</b> [NEohioPAL] scoring person needed</span></p>
<div><p class="MsoNormal">
need person to score a movie by april 6th. unpaid. 3 main themes and 2 variations combining 2 themes. i am just the messenger so send me your info and i will pass it on to the director. thank you! <a rel="nofollow" href="mailto:makers74@gmail.com" target="_blank">makers74@gmail.com</a></p>
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