[NEohioPAL] Copyrights (was: i want your VIDEOS)

Thu Jun 19 09:05:22 PDT 2008

Dear Professor Valentine,
Your post raises two interesting points:

1. Your students lack of knowledge of black actors. This is sad.  I can see that to some extent, but with movies and the proliferation of intellectual property on the internet, it is unfortunate.  Even before AlGore invented the Internet, I was still able to research that kind of stuff.  I got to know who Ethel Waters, Hattie McDaniel, and Eddie Anderson were as well as Claudia McNeil, Brock Peters, Greg Morris (from Cleveland).  In recent years Sue Johnson and Norma Powell at Wake Up and Lives further educated me on the subject.  

One thing I will admit is that since many productions do not always call for a person of African descent, and non-traditional casting is not always implemented, it was a pleasure to be one of the few white males cast in Beck Center's "Porgy and Bess" a few seasons back.  I was introduced to so many talented persons of color I had never worked with before.  (Of course, I have Scott Spence and William Clarence Marshall (who recommended me) for that experience.)  I learned a lot from it.  

2. You raise an interesting point about appropriating another person's work product.  Jerome Robbins copywrote all of his choreography etc and, I believe, in order to license a work that he was involved with, you must use his choreography.  I can't imagine "Tradition" being done any differently in "Fiddler."  

I have also read of R&H and other companies sending cease and desist letters when theatres depart from the theme of the show and theatres cast a woman to play Danny Zuko or a man to play Rizzo.  Though I do remember reading in Theatre Week about twenty years ago, a theatre in Texas cast a man to play Reno Sweeney in "Anything Goes", I do not remember if they were told to cease and desist.  I remember the "Grease" incident on NPR, and the theatre and cast were indignant that they had to cease and desist, not completely understanding the contractual terms of their license.

In cases where theatres are in violation, it's the attorney fees that become the expensive part of the litigation.  What R&H are going for is a court order telling you to stop conducting yourselves inappropriately under the license.  It's not monetary damages (like an auto accident case) as much as its injunctive relief of which the licensor is entitled to recoup the cost of seeking relief.

There are degrees to fair use and what constitutes it.  There are also issues such as parody, eg. the Actors Inequity website that seems to copy the Actors Equity website.

Remember, a license is a privilege to use or do something, not a right to use or do something.  Just as someone holds a license to practice law, medicine or nursing, the same can be revoked if one does not conform to the standards of the profession.  Or a license to drive can be revoked if you break the law concerning your driving.  It's a privilege, and the authority granting you the license can take it away for cause.

Christopher Fortunato
> Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2008 00:48:07 -0400> From: avalentine at wooster.edu> To: neohiopal at listserve.com; TBROWN at plaind.com> Subject: Re: [NEohioPAL] Copyrights (was: i want your VIDEOS)> > Before Fred shuts down the conversation and moves it to the other> website, I wanted to get a couple of thoughts and a couple of websites> out there.> > 1. It seems to me that Tony Brown wasn’t talking about sending> YouTube clips of entire performances, but rather commercial length> pieces. Many performance licenses do have a provision for this sort of> fair-use to promote the show. If it is not in a performance license, in> many cases, it can be negotiated or requested as a rider. Bottom line—if> you want to make a commercial for your show, just ask for permission. It> might take a bit of effort to get things straightened out, but all they> can say is no.> > 2. Equity has specific allowances for TV news coverage, cast album> recordings, commercials (including television & radio spots and> in-flight usage), talk shows, cable, archival tapings, documentaries and> other promotional areas. Having said that, Equity is working to take> down illegal videos of members’ work.> http://www.actorsequity.org/newsmedia/news2007/July27.YouTube.asp> > 3. The licensing companies for musicals are catching up with the> times, and realize that video taping can be a source of money for them> as well. For some titles (for example Disney shows and some of the> Rodgers and Hammerstein collection), an amateur company can purchase the> right to video tape and distribute copies to company members only (no> sales in the lobby).> > 4. I know many of us are torn about YouTube. For me as an educator,> it is invaluable. For example, I taught a course on African American> Theatre History to a predominantly white group of students. Many of them> had never heard of some of the great black performers like Andre de> Shields, Pearl Bailey, and many others. YouTube allowed me to quickly> show them clips shows, interviews, etc. Before YouTube, I could talk> about it, but that is no comparison to seeing it. To me, YouTube is like> going to the library and getting out a book for research. Of course, the> bigger question with copyright infringement is how was that “book”> created. Again, as the digital age advances, I hope production video> archives like the one at the New York Public Library will become> available to other libraries over the net. If you don’t know about this> valuable production research resource, go to:> http://www.actorsequity.org/newsmedia/news2006/TOFT.asp> > > 5. The conversation turned to the lawsuit against Carousel Dinner> Theatre. As a member of SSDC, I know they are quite serious about> protecting members’ intellectual property rights. One of the benefits of> being a union member is free legal representation concerning contract> matters—and this includes intellectual property like concept, blocking,> and choreography. A few years ago I was a swing in a professional> non-Equity dinner theatre production of Smokey Joe’s Café. The> choreographer had essentially recreated Joey McKneely’s original musical> staging. I doubt they had permission, but I couldn’t say for sure. Susan> Stroman has gotten smart about her work as a director/choreographer. It> seems she realizes that her shows would not be what they are without her> very imaginative staging ideas. Therefore, producers can now pay an> additional royalty to get the choreography notes when the other script> materials arrive. This is true for Crazy for You and The Producers.> Hopefully this will become an issue the union will take up. Regional> companies should be able to license choreography and staging notes when> they license the script, particularly for those show where the line is> fuzzy between the work of the playwright and the director/choreographer.> I’ve watched directors hack out pages of dance numbers or underscoring> because they didn’t understand why they were there, what purpose they> served, how they advanced the story, etc. Having staging notes would> certainly help them make an informed decision. I think as others see the> system working to Ms. Stroman’s financial benefit, more and more> directors and choreographers will get on the band wagon and ask to have> their work licensed as well. But honestly, if you REALLY want to> recreate someone’s staging or concept from the original production, you> should just ask and get permission. You would be surprised how easy it> is with many people. Allow enough lead time to contact the appropriate> agent or artist. Be prepared to pay a royalty if they say yes.> > > Ansley Valentine> Associate Professor> Co-Vice Chair, Kennedy Center American College Theatre Festival, Region> III> College of Wooster Film Studies Program Chair> > The College of Wooster> Department of Theatre & Dance> 1189 Beall Avenue> Wooster, OH 44691> 330-263-2028 Office> 330-347-1519 Cell Phone> 330-263-2690 Fax> >>> "Richard B. Ingraham" <rbingraham at sbcglobal.net> 6/18/2008 4:21 PM> >>>> > > > -----Original Message-----> > From: neohiopal-bounces at listserve.com > > [mailto:neohiopal-bounces at listserve.com] On Behalf Of Linda Ryan> > Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2008 11:30 AM> > To: cvlt at cvlt.org; neohiopal at listserve.com > > Subject: Re: [NEohioPAL] i want your VIDEOS> > > > > > Andrew brings up a good point; one that's always bothered me:> > the fact that many theaters have had to go the way CVLT has > > -- i.e., no video for fear of being shut down. I don't know > > who made the rule about no videos of shows, but I would think > > the actors in this country would be "up in arms" (whatever > > that phrase means) :-) about it.> > > > Hmmmm.... Actually Actors Equity's rules are usually more complex than> those by the rights holding organizations of the shows. But I realize> you're not specifically talking about professional actors. However the> rules established for professional organizations are often what becomes> the "norm" and rights organizations are not going to worry about having> numerous "rules" based on what "level" the organization is operating at.> We are probably lucky that there are separate royalty rates based on> whether you're a professional, educational or amateur organization.> > > > > I'm surprised, as rights-conscious as the American people are > > - always standing up for what they believe in - that we've > > allowed this policy to remain in place. Maybe there is a > > fight going on about it somewhere and I just haven't heard > > anything about it. But if not, there should be. I, for one, > > would like to have saved the shows I've been in for watching > > in my old age (okay, probably too late for that!) :-) but you > > get my drift. > > > > Rights conscious? I would respectfully disagree. :-)> > I think most folks pay almost no attention to copy right issues. Why do> things like file sharing software exist? Mostly to share copyrighted> content illegally. Why is all my professional software that I use for> my work have to have some arcane, complex "registration" method or have> a small "dongle" that I plug into my computer to operate? Because if it> didn't the authors of the software would never be able to make a living.> Everyone would just copy it freely and pay it no mind.> > I work with college students on a regular basis. It's a real eye opener> to see how much stuff is "shared". And when you ask them about it, many> simply don't even think about the fact that they are essentially> stealing something and robbing the original author of their fair income.> That attitude is changing slightly these days as we see the RIAA and> other rights organizations going after folks for the more serious> violations but there are also many who simply do not care.> > If you think this doesn't pertain to theatre copyrights then I'm sorry> to tell you that it does. I have watched as good friends (fellow> designers) of mine were "ripped off" by producers and even large> organization right here in town and beyond. It happens even to folks> like myself, a freelance designer... I've had my sound designs "ripped> off" on at least a couple of occasions. (and that's the ones that I> know about!) Yes... right here in town! I suspect that at least in one> of these examples the But if you're going to remount a show, using my Sound Design, then you> should be paying me for the reuse of my design. Of course the design> fees are not high enough to even bother with legal action on my part,> but that's a whole other subject. :-)> > Of course I guess all that those examples prove is that it goes both> ways. The people that worry the most about protecting their "works",> are sometimes the worst offenders and pay no attention to all the folks> they might be ripping off. And I include myself in that as well.> Although I at least try to do the right thing.> > If you think that there is not a "fight" going on Ms. Ryan, then I would> suggest that you have simply not been paying close enough attention.> :-)> > There is all the RIAA lawsuits going on, where they are even going after> minors and grandmothers. Those are the "news" stories that you'll hear> about in the major networks. If you want the more mundane stuff, then> you have to read trade magazines or hunt around on line.> > But a perfect example would be the recent lawsuit involving Carousel> Diner Theatre. The original director, choreographer (and I believe even> the set, lighting and costume designers as well) of Urinetown sued a> theatre in Chicago and Carousel for copying their staging. (and I> assume also their designs as well) This caused a huge stir in the> theatre community because it brings up the subject of how much staging,> choreography and set, costume and lighting designs are "original" for> each production and how much of it do you simply almost have to "copy"> because otherwise it would not be the same show without it. It's a very> fine line and the line is kind of "blurry" if you think hard about it.> Unfortunately I have not heard anything more about this lawsuit and> don't know if there has been any outcome as of yet. I'm mentioning this> case merely as an example not to cast judgment on any of the parties.> Since I've seen none of the productions involved I have no clue how> realistic the claims in the lawsuit were.> > I think what you are proposing, that theatres should be free to make> videos of their shows and then distribute them really isn't all that> much different than some of the file sharing that is going on over the> internet. It's just on a MUCH, MUCH smaller scale. While I can> understand the argument for allowing that type of stuff (and I'm sure it> goes on all the time anyway), it's one of those slippery slope type> situations. If I as a rights holder say, OK, this theatre can make> copies and distribute them because they are a bunch of amateurs anyway> and no one would pay any money for it, then it's not much of a stretch> until anyone can bring in a camera and start recording any show they> like whether they are part of the cast, crew or production in some way> or not, and then start making copies for sale or just give them away.> > We as artists should want to protect our work and craft. If I can just> download the bootleg off the internet some place then what's the point> of paying for a ticket to go see the real thing. Yes, I understand you> are not promoting that, but it would only be one small step to go from> copies for the cast and crew to letting people post it around freely.> > As with most things it's a moving target and there are a lot of grey> areas. Lets be realistic, when it comes down to filing a lawsuit it> will likely largely be decided by who has the better lawyers. :-)> > What we as artist should really be doing is trying to get the copyright> laws (and patent laws are even worse!) updated in this country so they> actually make sense for the society and times in which we live. Not the> society of 150 years ago when most of them were probably established.> But big organizations (ummm.. the Mouse!... that would be Disney) keep> getting our congress to extend copyrights and favor the big> organizations. Otherwise Mickey and friends would have been in the> public domain years ago! :-)> > Just some thoughts.... I could go on... :-)> > > Richard B. Ingraham> RBI Computers and Audio> http://www.rbicompaudio.20m.com/ > > > > _____________________NEohioPAL is SELF-SERVE. 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