[NEohioPAL] Indy Feature Film Auditions

[michael goulis]

I couldn’t seem to see the first post that started this, other than it just said un-paid indie film so I missed the “pretentious, insulting” etc. so keep that in mind please.  But…
 
As someone who’s with a local agency and it seems (from what I’ve heard) to book work slightly more than the average and also does lots more basically un-paid indie work around here, my opinion on this matter is layered and contextual.  It is NOT black and white but basically comes down to contextual “presentation” method – i.e.  who’s putting on the film, for what (you could call this a “media plan” as well, and why and then HOW they treat the talent involved. 
 
I’ve lived here slightly over two years and have had many wonderful, most fulfilling of my life experiences, and very few not so great ones with local film-makers.  I’ve been treated like near royalty by several Virginia Marti College of Art and Design students who were so touched I’d spend my time doing their film for free (students have no $, you know this) that the creative collaboration was completely worth the lack of $ and time spent on it, and have had the same experiences with several film-makers a bit past the average college age who were trying to do something creative  with their lives on the side.  Never once have I ever felt, abused, dis-respected or under-appreciated by ANY local film-makers I’ve worked with who couldn’t pay-  they’ve given me nothing but the utmost, respect, love, and appreciation.  
 
Moving on, let’s remember that 1.  This is only a business that makes money and warrants paying you money when there’s money to be made in some way back.  2.  If there’s no money to be made then someone else is going to pay out of somebody’s pocket (their own, a diff producer) for no ROI and thus logically creates a disincentive to even bother creating the film in the first place or to do so on the scale wherein funds become necessary.  These are mere logical facts.  If you’re not prepared to accept that then your problem is one of a more idealistic nature and for that I would say seek counseling for inflated super-ego issues.  
 
…so from here and getting back to a film’s “presentation”, it is your decision/commitment to make ahead of time (and then responsibly stick to until after production is done- luckily though, you can change your mind before each new project) as to whether you agree in principle with acting for free or not and whether that belief is flexible to context or not.  Questions worth considering in this pursuit of your true feelings on the subject look like: 
 
If I decide I don’t believe in acting for free ever, at what point did I earn this right? That all my acting is so professional that in doing any of it at all,  I must be paid?  If I’ve hit this mark- why am I not in actual feature films?   
 
What if the director is a 21 year film student- should someone who clearly makes less than I do annually need to pay me out of their own pocket or have their parents pay me so I can appear in their student film?  
 
With the above, what if I really like the story and just think it would be great to do?
 
 Should I separate amateur from professional experiences and make decisions accordingly? 
 
Do I need to accept myself that if I am not getting enough paid work through my agency or whomever that I, am in fact, NOT a professional full-time actor by sheer economic law?  
 
If that’s the case, perhaps I should either see what a job pays and if it doesn’t ignore it instead of complaining about what others may be comfortable with?  
 
If I have a “real job” and so does the director/producer of this film and this director/producer of this film makes no bones about admitting he’s got no $,  should I expect money out of his/her pocket just because they want to make a film and I want to act in a film?  Should I maybe consider this more of a collaboration?  Why does investing in the equipment to make a film mean they have to be the ones who have to pay just because I think I’m an actor (those with SAG or AFTRA cards can confirm that yes, they are actors, not just folks who say they like to act)?
 
Finally, if there’s no Hollywood style producer behind a film and very little budget, should I as an “actor” who is obviously not a full-time actor in LA, either judge the local director for not having figured out the key to getting budget or being successful in the same way that I have thus far failed to reach the level of success in being a full-time paid actor? Maybe I need to realize that in some cases, I’m technically and de facto on the same professional level as the local director/film-maker who can’t pay me. If I were above that, I probably wouldn’t be acting in Cleveland at all currently…
 
If I decide that I/no one should ever act for free because it devalues the concept of acting-am I OK with effectively discouraging kids/people from getting into film-making by grabbing cameras and finding people interested in acting to do the acting for the film they want to learn to make/try to make?  Am I ok with that de facto negative reinforcement as a so-called “artist”?  (and If I only am into acting for $, am I an artist at all and does that matter to me?)
 
Now for me, the answers to some of these questions/my thoughts on acting around here are as such/ look like this- 
 
·         If you’re a money-making company or ad agency and you’re going to use my likeness/work to sell something and make $, you HAVE to pay me and pay me well.  Sorry Goodyear or anyone else, I’d never represent you for free. This stuff’s easy though- agency calls, you read,  they cast you, you ask how much it pays.  They tell you and if you like it, you accept.  
 
·         If you pay me and pay me well, you can tell me what to do, when we’re doing it, etc. with-in reason and I’ll shut up and follow direction if I agreed to the work to begin with (my agency does a good job of telling you mostly everything up front so you’re agreeing to something or not).   
 
·         If I really like your story and realize that no one’s knocking down my door to play really awesome roles for lots of money and that even IF I moved to LA I’d not likely just have them handed to me (and no less not anytime soon) – I’ll gladly do it for free so long as you’re nice and respectful to me, it films on weekends (as I will take off work for paid gigs but sorry, not for free), and you feed me.  
 
·         If you are younger than me or make less money annually than me, would be paying me out of your own pocket, have little likelihood of making any $ back from it* and all of the above is accurate, I have a hard time taking your money, especially if you’re a student,  or you’re an indie film-maker just trying to create something and you have kids, etc.  Really,  how could I take a 20 year’s old money that I know from being a 20 year old some time ago was made waiting tables when I have my own source of income?  Really, that would just be embarrassing.  
 
 
*really, the only way you can make $ from a film is distribution or winning awards at film-festivals.  Well the likelihood to get either of those without making a film with a budget to begin with is slim so it’s safe to say if they aren’t paying you,  they’re not going to profit from you’re work either.  This really leads me to say the next thing-
 
·         I am not deluded and I believe in economic laws-  by virtue of the fact that I have NOT moved to LA to pursue being a full-time always-paid professional actor (because let’s face it, the industry dictates where you can be a full time actor and you either play along or don’t.  believe me, LA isn’t missing anyone reticent to go there- there’s ALREADY a lot more talent than jobs…)  I don’t see how I can think of myself as so much above a local film-maker that they need to pay me for my time and skill when they may well not even be paying themselves for their own time/have invested their own $ into equipment/are taking their own time away from their families so I can be in a film at all*.  Now there’s a difference between a true production company and a local film-maker, though many film-makers have little company names,  but let’s face it,  the average local film-maker who’s going to ask you to act for free is going to invest themselves just as much if not moreso than you as an actor to get their film made-  I’ve seen it several times over.  
 
*fact, life is opportunity costs and derived demand- if no one’s begging you to act in their film for money, at that moment, you are not worth paying (in arguing opportunity costs- those would be for what NON acting related activities you’d be doing like golfing, etc.  and thus, still not warrant payment).  If you have options, you have earned the right to pick the best option.  Or, you can not act at all.  
 
In conclusion/to repeat: I guess I’m saying pick your projects/battles and if you refuse to work for free, accept you will have a boring life as an actor in Cleveland where most paid work is commercial/industrial or move.  If you like the idea of a film and are offered the role,  do it.  If you’re busy with other stuff or don’t love it,  don’t accept the role.  But please don’t blame a local film-maker for not having figured out the key to having the $ to pay you when you yourself most likely haven’t figured out how to get yourself paid all the time/full time either.  
 
 I’ve lived here slightly over two years and have had many wonderful, most fulfilling of my life experiences, and very few not so great ones.  I’ve been treated like near royalty by several Virginia Marti College of Art and Design students who were so touched I’d spend my time doing their film for free (students have no $, you know this) that the creative collaboration was completely worth the lack of $ and time spent on it, and have had the same experiences with several film-makers a bit past the average college age who were trying to do something creative with their lives on the side.  Never once have I ever felt, abused, dis-respected or under-appreciated by ANY local film-makers I’ve worked with who couldn’t pay-  they’ve given me nothing but the utmost, respect, love, and appreciation.  
 
Now if a Hollywood film or some company comes here forget all that, I’m getting PAID!
 
Mike Goulis








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To: donnam.williams at hotmail.com
Date: Tue, 8 Dec 2009 15:03:19 -0500
From: actorloganfry at aol.com
CC: neohiopal at listserve.com
Subject: Re: [NEohioPAL] Indy Feature Film Auditions



I'm probably the wrong person to say anything, since I've never had an acting class and never went to film school; but I have been in films with Kevin Bacon, Will Smith, Danny and Chris Masterson, Bijou Phillips, George Segal and Tobey Maguire.   Did I sit down with them for a beer after a tough day's shoot?  No.  Was I on the same set?  Well, yes (except Maguire, of course--we got Spider-Man, not Peter Parker).  

Most of those projects involved travel to NYC, CT and NJ and the pay was up to about $100.00 a day.  Wow!  What a deal!  Background.  Trees that move.  Standing under the Brooklyn Bridge at 3:00 AM in 14 degree weather in January.  $100.00 or so.  I didn't break even on any of them, except Spider-Man 3.  So what?  

Cleveland has a small film industry; but if it weren't for directors and actors willing to work for free, Cleveland wouldn't have a film industry at all.  Okay, there are some commercial houses out there, and they do pay their actors (but not always).  I'm talking about movies--film.  

If we really want a film industry here, we need to develop skills.  Cast, crew--skills.  Will we get another Spider-Man 3?  No dream of mine.  Another Welcome to Collinwood or American Splendor?  That would be sweet.  And maybe another one of our own aspiring directors will break out again some day.  You need to start somewhere.  

I'm I a hobbyist?  Who cares?  If I can help make something possible for some director out there who wants to work with me and other amateurs, that's good enough for me.  We can actually make it happen--instead of whining about the sad state of the film industry in Cleveland.  

So if you don't like the concept--don't audition.  I probably won't get the role even if I do.  I'll still be there.  

Logan Fry
Last role: aged zombie in "Death of the Dead"
My line: "Help me - Help me - The bastards ate my wife"
Pay:  craft table for lunch

 		 	   		  
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